Babylon Podcast #181: Darkness Ascending (Season 5)

Welcome to Show #181!

Happy… Koshgiving?

And all of us here send our thoughts and prayers to Peter Woodward and his family, wishing them well after the passing of Edward Woodward.

Space Station. Deorbiting. Flying Debris splashing down. Summer is befuddled, Tim and Jeffrey not so much.

Deep Geeking: Tim, Summer and Jeffrey discuss many of the consquences and the subtexts in “Darkness Ascending”.

We argue for quite a bit about the nature of Garibaldi’s dream, how much was dream and how much was or wasn’t influenced by Lyta’s telepathic curiosity (and whether or not that itself was real or dream), and talk a bit more about Lennier and his mission, and of the telepath DNA deal between Lyta and G’Kar.

And yes, Summer really does want to know if Garibaldi’s BFG-10000 survived production and is squirreled away somewhere, or if it was broken down and recycled after the episode was done.

Feedback: …and the “Day of the Dead” theories continue! We will wear Tim down eventually, and make him one of us. We also take a trip down the voicemail rabbit hole and end up skirting the Star Trek universe along the way.

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Promo: Bird House Rules: Ten Minutes on Twitter with Tee Morris
Promo: Variant Frequencies: Hath a Darkness


  1. ChristopherNYC says
  2. Thank you Tim for filling in the precious details on my rant.
    Feed your head.

  3. Pete a.k.a. "Charlie" says

    Good discussion of the episode, especially regarding whether Lita caused Garibaldi’s dream.

    I was hoping to get some info on a prop. Maybe Jeffrey could help with this: just after the scene with Garibaldi and Lise at the Fresh Air restaurant, Sheridan and Delenn are shown briefly at a small table in someone’s quarters. The table contains a complicated looking object. Is it a game? A meditative device? An appetizer? Would like to hear what y’all think.

  4. Gary The Great says

    The more I look at Garabaldi’s BFG the more it looks like a drive shaft from a car or truck.

  5. I’m going to say here, first, that I really appreciate you, guys, talking about the realities of space and space travel in /our/ times. Fi is nice and we all love it, but it’s important to reflect on /where/ it will all be coming from (if we’ll ever /get/ to there, that is).

    I’m also going to side with Tim on the whole Lyta appearing to Michael being her intentional projection rather than just him dreaming it up. While Summer’s points are valid, here’s my countering of them.

    1) Yes, Michael /knew/ about Lyta’s advances to an extent, which is /why/ she would be comfortable appearing to /him/, were he to wake and find her in his room. I got the impression that she wasn’t really /wanting/ to wake him either, but was more just kind of sitting there watching him, perhaps testing how long she could keep that projection up and running.

    2) I also don’t think that she had /any/ intention of rummaging through his mind. Why would she? She didn’t /completely/ lose her morals and unsolicited scanning wouldn’t be something she’d be comfortable with in regards to a /friend/ (of sorts). Telepaths /were/ trained, after all, to block out the external noise and for someone as powerful as Lyta became–it would be so easy to do that she wouldn’t really need to /concentrate/ on it, it’d be a reflexive sort of thing.

    I also think that the eyes were /supposed/ to hint for us at this /not/ being a dream. /I/, personally, see the white eyes as the only plausible choice for /Lyta/ because I kind of always got a feeling that part of Lyta’s “upgrade” by Vorlons was to make her more like /them/. And remember when Vorlons were going in and out of her, while she was carrying them about? The sort of energy flow that they were–always looked to me very much like that white glow in her eyes, when she’d stop putting brakes on herself and let the power within flow through her freely.

    I did like how Lenier was presented in this episode, too. Very much. Him staying awake and watching made perfect sense to me, though, rather than it being something “unusual for him”. I mean, he comes from a culture that is very warrior and honour oriented. A /good/ soldier, even in /our/ cultures, /will/ watch the murdering of innocent (if the only choice he has is to stand by), so that he’d burn such an image into his mind and heart to serve as motivation for the /later/, when he /can/ finally do something about it. Maybe I have such a perception because I myself served, but that scene always struck me as the most natural thing for him to do.

    And lastly… Dear TIM. ~grin~ You /are/ already agreeing with us, somewhat, without even noticing that you do. You’ve already admitted that you /can/ see it all working out from purely symbolic/religious point of view. And this is /ALL/ that it was–that whole pink coloured episode. There’s really no need to be looking into anything /else/, in relation to it.

  6. Pete a.k.a. "Charlie" says

    Looks like I may have come across the answer to my own question about the object on the table in Darkness Ascending (around 28:22 into the episode). The site below indicates that it is a game called Global Chess.

    More info on the game at the second link:

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